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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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from Australia for science and reason

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[Music]

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yes it's the skeptics own podcast

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episode 584 the 24th of November 2019

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Rashad Saunders here with you from quite

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a remarkable week in Sydney Australia we

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had some days in the past week where the

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bushfire smoke was thick it's a it's

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quite something it's worse than I've

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ever seen it I went downtown I could not

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properly make out one end of the harbour

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from the other for those of you who know

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Sydney I was at Circular Key looking

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north towards Luna Park and that side of

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the harbour couldn't quite see it

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properly stinging eyes bad taste in the

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mouth it's it's not good and of course

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Sydney is not the only place to be

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suffering bushfire smoke at the moment

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and here other cities are similarly

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affected but it's not just the the smoky

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conditions people in Sydney and other

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places have to put up with of course

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many people sadly have lost their homes

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and there's been widespread property

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damage many poor animals too have

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perished in the last few weeks due to

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these fires and I find it amazing the

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other day I was channel surfing on AM

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radio he and I happened across one of

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the more conservative AM radio stations

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people ringing in normally older people

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I will say this is maybe this is the

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okay boomer meme going around absolutely

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[Music]

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vehement in their condemnation of any

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suggestion of global warming or climate

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change there is a generation or no

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that's that's very unfair there's some

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people within a generation it seems that

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a absolutely vehemently convinced that

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global warming is a is a conspiracy or a

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hoax and this is the classic case of

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cherry-picking a lot of these

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conservative radio hosts will find bits

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of data over

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years that support their point of view

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or they'll dig out some expert that

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supports them I can't remember I think

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it's one of those classic sayings no

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matter how crazy the idea you will

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always find a PhD who supports that but

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let's turn to what's coming up on this

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week's episode of the skeptic zone we're

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going to kick off with dick Smith the

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one and only the patron of Australian

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skeptics one of the early founders of

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Australian skeptics dick Smith now a

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couple years ago I ran Segev and I from

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the Australian skeptics visit a dick to

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interview him for a series of video

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interviews we are doing last week he

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would have heard Ian Bryce giving you

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tales and stories of the early days of

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Australian skeptics this week dick Smith

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talks about the time he flew James Randi

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to Australia in 1980 to take place in a

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very large scale water divining test

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dick talks about that and other

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interesting adventures along the way

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following that it's our good friends at

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the good thinking society doing good

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work again this time taking on ear

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candles that that modality that sort of

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sums up the very idea of quackery good

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thinking in the UK have had some success

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in taking on ear candles find out more

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soon then we bring you the news of

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author Bailey Harris now I spoke to

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Bailey Harris some weeks ago on the

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sceptic zone I met her in DragonCon in

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Atlanta in the USA she wrote the

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Stardust series of books well earlier

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this year Bailey visited the Ark

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Encounter in Kentucky this is the giant

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replica of Noah's Ark and just recently

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a video has been published about her

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visit to the Ark Encounter I'm going to

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play you a few highlights and well just

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to whet your appetite then to round off

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the show the hole in the pole part three

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Tim Mendham the executive officer for

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Australian skeptics and the editor of

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the skeptic magazine not to be confused

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with any other magazine around the world

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that happens to be called the skeptic

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this is the one from Australian skeptics

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Tim wraps up his series of

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people trying to find hidden underground

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worlds the hole in the pole part three

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stay tuned at the end of the show do you

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stay tuned when you're listening to a

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podcast and said how it works

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that used to be in the old days they'd

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say stay tuned to this radio station for

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further information or stay tuned to

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this TV station after the commercials we

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will do this I don't think you actually

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do stay tuned to a podcast keep playing

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the podcast towards the end of the show

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for more announcements from me more

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information but now it's time for me to

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run downstairs and have some nice corn

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on the cob with mixed vegetables yummy

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and healthy will I do that I hope you

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enjoy the skeptic zone

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[Music]

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as part of the ongoing project to record

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the history of Australian skeptics

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around Segev and I visited the home of

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dick Smith

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Nick Smith is one of the original

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patrons of the Australian skeptics an

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adventurer and Explorer dick Smith was

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one of the first people to fly a

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helicopter solo around the world he even

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flew a helicopter to the North Pole and

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a hot-air balloon from Australia to New

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Zealand dick Smith of course is the

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founder of Dick Smith electronics a

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famous brand in Australia for many years

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dick played a vital role in the

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formation of Australian sceptics by

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flying James Randi to Australia way back

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in 1980 to bring James Randi to

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Australia I'd read quite a lot about him

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in the skeptical inquirer at the

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American magazine and I thought yeah I'd

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love to bring him out here and we'll

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make a documentary I just started making

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documentary films and so the idea was to

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set out a challenge and actually what

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happened was beyond my wildest dreams

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when he ended up on the don lane show

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yeah

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well was the the documentary which later

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became called James Randi in Australia

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this is the water divining test and if

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memory serves that was conducted up ride

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yes

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in those days I'd stuff started Dick

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Smith electronics was doing well and we

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had a new warehouse it ride and there

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was a block of land nearby

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and this were the days before emails or

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anything like that but I contacted James

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Randi by telex and then I talked to him

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on the phone and he said he sent me an

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example of a test he'd done I think it

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was in Europe and he said dick if you're

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prepared to set up a grid of pipes and

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you have some land he said I'm very

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happy to come out here he came for

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nothing we just covered his airfares and

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he stayed with people I in our house

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here and the fascinating thing was that

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I was using an X ABC television producer

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Bob Connolly to make documentary films

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on following Mick's

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Flores that Bob was a bit of a skeptic

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so he said fantastic we'll make a film

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I contacted Ted Thomas at channel 7 he

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was the managing director and he said oh

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yeah I'll buy the film from you and so

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it was agreed that by the film and so we

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made this documentary on the water

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divining which was a masterpiece in the

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end we didn't realize how important it

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would be for the skeptical new levitated

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spoon benders water diviners beware

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James Randi psychic investigator is

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among you I'm not here to demean anybody

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I'm not here to put anybody down so to

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speak I'm here to investigate I can

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anticipate from my past experience 35

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years of it in this business that it

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will probably be the essentially the

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same story that it's been everyplace

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else in the world people who innocently

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deceived themselves and that small

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residual of people who go out of their

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way to actually defraud the rest of they

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are their fellow citizens and you've got

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$10,000 and there are two Australian

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businessman who have each got 10,000

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that's $30,000 for anyone who can

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successfully demonstrate the paranormal

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how confident are you of keeping your

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money well let me see now I'll show you

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the check I've lured this check around

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now this one has only been carried since

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June 25th 1985 to renew it every now and

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then I don't know about your banks but

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every six months they check like this

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goes dead you see it's no longer valid

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for 15 years this is the 15th year I've

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carried a check around like this in this

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terra delue old wallet that check for

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$10,000 I've never had to give up five

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cents of it so far that doesn't mean

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that I won't it doesn't mean that I'm

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not willing I can lose I can lose

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$10,000 but I would gladly surrender

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that $10,000 if I were given evidence of

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one paranormal ability of any kind

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because it would open my universe much

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larger than it is it's a wonderful

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universe I live in I enjoy life from day

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to day I have my ups and downs like

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everyone else but I think it is a

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wonderful world that we live in

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I don't need miracles of a semi

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religious nature as they put it in order

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to make my world any better but to be

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offered something like that to know that

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a person could float in the air could

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find concealed water underground could

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bend a spoon by merely thinking about it

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that would make my universe a hundred

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times bigger than it is and although

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more marvelous it would be worth $10,000

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I remember saying to Randy Randy look we

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can't go ahead with this we're going to

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destroy these people because they'd

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signed a document saying that have no

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excuses and Randy said dick

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have no fear it will have no effect on

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their beliefs don't you know what what

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do you reckon I'll say you know if they

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file he'll do all the rationalization so

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the rationalization is take you'll be

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amazed what they come up with this

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rationalizations they'll they'll involve

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Castro's equal signs unfortunate aspects

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of the Moon all kinds of things and also

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they'll see negative vibrations but I

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think how can I do that if I get a sign

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with us the actual if I get a sign and

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say that I'm very happy and I've checked

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a bit of pipe it doesn't make much

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difference they'll find a

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rationalization now I've been 35 years

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in this business and you'd think that

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I'd be able to come up with all the

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rationalization I'm surprised the dalles

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use particularly are very adept at this

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now to you and me to reasonable rational

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logical people they have failed and

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there doesn't seem to be any such power

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but to them they're not acting logically

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so what what frustrates me is what's the

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use of doing this if think we're not

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going to do the only thing you can do

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and the only person you're going to

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convince of it is I think particularly

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the younger generation who are on the

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verge they say I wonder does such a

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thing really happen or not the

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old-timers who have believed in this all

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of their life they're not gonna change

272
00:11:21,259 --> 00:11:19,110
and so sure enough at the end when it's

273
00:11:22,939 --> 00:11:21,269
found they all failed they all had a

274
00:11:25,129 --> 00:11:22,949
reason and so the human patter

275
00:11:26,930 --> 00:11:25,139
self-deluded is unlimited I learned that

276
00:11:29,660 --> 00:11:26,940
at the time because I didn't want to

277
00:11:31,460 --> 00:11:29,670
take away people's beliefs even if they

278
00:11:33,350 --> 00:11:31,470
were wrong I mean people have the right

279
00:11:35,210 --> 00:11:33,360
to be deluded but in this particular

280
00:11:37,579 --> 00:11:35,220
case it had no effect on their beliefs

281
00:11:38,809 --> 00:11:37,589
but all the people watching or most of

282
00:11:41,059 --> 00:11:38,819
the people watching it had a great

283
00:11:44,059 --> 00:11:41,069
effect on when we did the documentary we

284
00:11:45,620 --> 00:11:44,069
also had Philip Adams lying on a desk in

285
00:11:48,050 --> 00:11:45,630
the Dick Smith electronics office and

286
00:11:50,179 --> 00:11:48,060
Randy was performing psychic surgery on

287
00:11:52,610 --> 00:11:50,189
him that was part of the film so we just

288
00:11:55,579 --> 00:11:52,620
didn't cover divining there was quite a

289
00:11:59,030 --> 00:11:55,589
lot and also Randy unremember he he had

290
00:12:00,530 --> 00:11:59,040
this pencil rolling up and down the the

291
00:12:01,910 --> 00:12:00,540
the desk and we couldn't work it out

292
00:12:03,259 --> 00:12:01,920
we're looking underneath it we finally

293
00:12:06,710 --> 00:12:03,269
work and he was just blowing it with his

294
00:12:08,990 --> 00:12:06,720
mouth but he was ism was is a master

295
00:12:12,199 --> 00:12:09,000
magician without any doubt and he had

296
00:12:14,389 --> 00:12:12,209
the ability to get the audience on side

297
00:12:17,329 --> 00:12:14,399
and from that point on without dad his

298
00:12:18,910 --> 00:12:17,339
trip to Australia helped him and he was

299
00:12:20,980 --> 00:12:18,920
appearing on the Johnny Carson

300
00:12:22,420 --> 00:12:20,990
so in the United States and he was

301
00:12:25,030 --> 00:12:22,430
becoming more and more famous in the

302
00:12:27,460 --> 00:12:25,040
u.s. of course he had a major falling

303
00:12:29,410 --> 00:12:27,470
out with the skeptical movement because

304
00:12:30,850 --> 00:12:29,420
Uri Geller took him on and were all and

305
00:12:33,100 --> 00:12:30,860
Uri Geller was also suing the whole

306
00:12:35,740 --> 00:12:33,110
skeptics movement and they didn't stand

307
00:12:36,970 --> 00:12:35,750
behind Randy and so in the end Randy

308
00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:36,980
went on his own for quite a long time

309
00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:38,930
now they're all back best mates again

310
00:12:44,259 --> 00:12:42,410
which is great another another important

311
00:12:47,860 --> 00:12:44,269
story is that when we were doing the

312
00:12:50,620 --> 00:12:47,870
tests for the Randy documentary I think

313
00:12:52,180 --> 00:12:50,630
we found all of the diviners clustered

314
00:12:54,129 --> 00:12:52,190
around talking to each other and so I

315
00:12:55,930 --> 00:12:54,139
walked over noes listen to them and they

316
00:12:57,490 --> 00:12:55,940
were saying to each other this is not

317
00:13:00,759 --> 00:12:57,500
going to be fair we're all going to get

318
00:13:03,400 --> 00:13:00,769
this money the $50,000 so they'd agreed

319
00:13:05,110 --> 00:13:03,410
to share it they'd all decided it would

320
00:13:07,750 --> 00:13:05,120
be only fair to Shara that was so

321
00:13:09,490 --> 00:13:07,760
convinced that the $50,000 what a

322
00:13:10,900 --> 00:13:09,500
laydown Mercia and then another

323
00:13:12,340 --> 00:13:10,910
interesting thing which happened I'm not

324
00:13:14,980 --> 00:13:12,350
sure if it stayed in the film it might

325
00:13:17,379 --> 00:13:14,990
have that we had Australia's best of

326
00:13:19,780 --> 00:13:17,389
honors there and we also had about ten

327
00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:19,790
of Australia's best gold diviners so

328
00:13:24,460 --> 00:13:22,130
we'd bought out we'd borrowed an ingot

329
00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:24,470
of gold which came from the mint and we

330
00:13:28,930 --> 00:13:26,810
had security guards and everything but

331
00:13:30,910 --> 00:13:28,940
one of the diviners dropped his little

332
00:13:32,319 --> 00:13:30,920
bit of gold see most of the diviners

333
00:13:33,550 --> 00:13:32,329
hold a bit of gold in their hand a

334
00:13:35,290 --> 00:13:33,560
little bit of water to get the reading

335
00:13:37,840 --> 00:13:35,300
so he had his video God but he dropped

336
00:13:39,730 --> 00:13:37,850
it so in the end we had Australia's best

337
00:13:41,860 --> 00:13:39,740
diviners all trying to fund it they

338
00:13:44,980 --> 00:13:41,870
never found it again it disappeared a

339
00:13:48,939 --> 00:13:44,990
little bit of gold into the bushes or

340
00:13:51,519 --> 00:13:48,949
somewhere so to me it really taught me

341
00:13:54,069 --> 00:13:51,529
that water divining documentary that was

342
00:13:57,130 --> 00:13:54,079
the start of realizing that we're all

343
00:13:58,449 --> 00:13:57,140
self dilute in some way and we should

344
00:14:01,120 --> 00:13:58,459
all try and look for some evidence

345
00:14:02,889 --> 00:14:01,130
Before we jump in and believe something

346
00:14:04,809 --> 00:14:02,899
now let me tell you another story when

347
00:14:07,449 --> 00:14:04,819
Randy was here this is a fascinating one

348
00:14:10,269 --> 00:14:07,459
he was in my office and we'd done the

349
00:14:12,490 --> 00:14:10,279
tests outside with the diviners and that

350
00:14:14,590 --> 00:14:12,500
all failed and there was a reporter

351
00:14:16,689 --> 00:14:14,600
interviewing Randy and the reporter was

352
00:14:18,699 --> 00:14:16,699
from the country he said mate I believe

353
00:14:20,860 --> 00:14:18,709
in water divining my dad used it my

354
00:14:22,900 --> 00:14:20,870
families used it it's which I represent

355
00:14:25,059 --> 00:14:22,910
nothing you will tell me will show me

356
00:14:26,439 --> 00:14:25,069
that it doesn't work and so Randy

357
00:14:28,540 --> 00:14:26,449
grabbed he said get a couple of coat

358
00:14:30,730 --> 00:14:28,550
hangers and so we bent to coat hanger so

359
00:14:32,470 --> 00:14:30,740
they were just in an L shape and he said

360
00:14:35,290 --> 00:14:32,480
dick can you go down to the warehouse

361
00:14:36,850 --> 00:14:35,300
get a big speaker magnet so he got the

362
00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:36,860
big speaker magnet of course if you put

363
00:14:40,150 --> 00:14:38,570
the rods near the speaker magnet they

364
00:14:41,710 --> 00:14:40,160
would pull over to the magnet and he

365
00:14:43,660 --> 00:14:41,720
said now what I'm gonna do to the

366
00:14:45,340 --> 00:14:43,670
reporter to the journalist he said I'm

367
00:14:47,170 --> 00:14:45,350
gonna put the speaker magnet in a box

368
00:14:48,069 --> 00:14:47,180
which he did and he said the Box on the

369
00:14:50,350 --> 00:14:48,079
end of the table

370
00:14:54,040 --> 00:14:50,360
he said now he said to the reporter I

371
00:14:56,530 --> 00:14:54,050
want you to try and go past the box and

372
00:14:58,480 --> 00:14:56,540
the magnet but try and keep the rods

373
00:15:01,120 --> 00:14:58,490
from being pulled over by the magnetic

374
00:15:03,250 --> 00:15:01,130
force so the reporter goes past it and

375
00:15:03,670 --> 00:15:03,260
the rods bend over make link against the

376
00:15:05,230 --> 00:15:03,680
box

377
00:15:07,689 --> 00:15:05,240
he said no try it again so he but the

378
00:15:09,250 --> 00:15:07,699
other way Baum they go over and then he

379
00:15:11,019 --> 00:15:09,260
said oh that's strange because there's

380
00:15:12,850 --> 00:15:11,029
no magnet there and he lifted the box by

381
00:15:15,250 --> 00:15:12,860
sleight of hand he'd removed the magnet

382
00:15:17,980 --> 00:15:15,260
and it was an absolute proof that when

383
00:15:20,470 --> 00:15:17,990
you think there's a magnet there it's

384
00:15:22,569 --> 00:15:20,480
like walking up an escalator you sort of

385
00:15:24,250 --> 00:15:22,579
tread differently and in in this

386
00:15:27,340 --> 00:15:24,260
particular case it just showed me

387
00:15:29,500 --> 00:15:27,350
absolutely how if you think something's

388
00:15:31,990 --> 00:15:29,510
happening about the muscles in your hand

389
00:15:33,610 --> 00:15:32,000
will move and they'll do what you think

390
00:15:35,769 --> 00:15:33,620
should happen even though there's

391
00:15:39,220 --> 00:15:35,779
nothing there to pull it another little

392
00:15:42,819 --> 00:15:39,230
story of these things come back to me of

393
00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:42,829
our dowsing test with James Randi I said

394
00:15:46,750 --> 00:15:45,290
to one of them I said look if you can

395
00:15:49,750 --> 00:15:46,760
find gold with a hundred percent

396
00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:49,760
accuracy I why aren't you wealthy

397
00:15:51,759 --> 00:15:51,290
because they all came and they had no

398
00:15:53,980 --> 00:15:51,769
money

399
00:15:55,990 --> 00:15:53,990
and he looked at me and he touching on

400
00:16:00,100 --> 00:15:56,000
the Sun he said dick we're all not

401
00:16:02,259 --> 00:16:00,110
interested in money like you are it's so

402
00:16:03,490 --> 00:16:02,269
lovely and so they weren't interested in

403
00:16:05,110 --> 00:16:03,500
money but they were all planning what

404
00:16:07,180 --> 00:16:05,120
they're going to do when they got the

405
00:16:09,370 --> 00:16:07,190
forty or fifty thousand dollars or

406
00:16:11,199 --> 00:16:09,380
whatever it ended up to be we bought

407
00:16:13,180 --> 00:16:11,209
Randy out I'd sent press releases out

408
00:16:14,829 --> 00:16:13,190
the media were not interested basically

409
00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:14,839
had no real interest in the water

410
00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:16,850
divining test at all but then I got a

411
00:16:22,509 --> 00:16:19,850
phone call from the producer at channel

412
00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:22,519
9 in Melbourne for the Don Lane show now

413
00:16:26,319 --> 00:16:24,170
I'd appeared on the Don Lane show from

414
00:16:28,210 --> 00:16:26,329
time to time and I knew Don was a total

415
00:16:30,579 --> 00:16:28,220
believer in Uri Geller and Doris Stokes

416
00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:30,589
he believed in everything and they said

417
00:16:34,689 --> 00:16:33,410
ah Don would like Randy to come on and I

418
00:16:36,730 --> 00:16:34,699
thought well that's a bit strange but

419
00:16:39,250 --> 00:16:36,740
it'll be great publicity we had no idea

420
00:16:41,620 --> 00:16:39,260
of course that when Randy went on and

421
00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:41,630
the segment when Don lost his temper and

422
00:16:46,540 --> 00:16:43,250
threw the spoons off and walked off his

423
00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:46,550
own show living a mr. James Randi with

424
00:16:49,630 --> 00:16:47,690
he'll television right around the

425
00:16:51,070 --> 00:16:49,640
country stanlon dollars the people to

426
00:16:52,810 --> 00:16:51,080
say people are fakes you said Doris

427
00:16:54,519 --> 00:16:52,820
Stokes knows make know I can say uri

428
00:16:56,199 --> 00:16:54,529
geller is a fake you came here and

429
00:16:58,030 --> 00:16:56,209
you've given everybody a lot of lizards

430
00:16:59,920 --> 00:16:58,040
no no when you haven't done anything to

431
00:17:01,770 --> 00:16:59,930
show us a lot of tricks that you're too

432
00:17:09,119 --> 00:17:01,780
bad you know

433
00:17:14,349 --> 00:17:11,739
so you said he was a fake you called him

434
00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:14,359
a to do you call them a two-bit magician

435
00:17:18,789 --> 00:17:16,730
you said he was a fake and you said he

436
00:17:20,710 --> 00:17:18,799
didn't I'm not defending your ego what I

437
00:17:22,899 --> 00:17:20,720
am defending is you you come over here

438
00:17:24,460 --> 00:17:22,909
with this big reputation you give us a

439
00:17:26,229 --> 00:17:24,470
lot of lip service about all this stuff

440
00:17:27,639 --> 00:17:26,239
that you're gonna prove you go against

441
00:17:29,109 --> 00:17:27,649
the lady like Doris Stokes who never

442
00:17:30,909 --> 00:17:29,119
harmed anybody in her whole life and you

443
00:17:33,159 --> 00:17:30,919
call her a Charlotte and the fake you

444
00:17:35,049 --> 00:17:33,169
know he said yes I do you said that she

445
00:17:35,649 --> 00:17:35,059
was a liar on the radio you called her a

446
00:17:43,919 --> 00:17:35,659
liar

447
00:17:47,379 --> 00:17:43,929
no and that woman would break an you can

448
00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:47,389
and of course from that instant on Randi

449
00:17:52,029 --> 00:17:49,369
was famous I'll give you an example that

450
00:17:54,879 --> 00:17:52,039
when Randy arrived back in Sydney to

451
00:17:58,299 --> 00:17:54,889
come up to my house here from the next

452
00:17:59,979 --> 00:17:58,309
morning I went out to the scenic uses

453
00:18:01,629 --> 00:17:59,989
for the airport to pick up Randy there

454
00:18:03,639 --> 00:18:01,639
are all these media people there the

455
00:18:05,349 --> 00:18:03,649
television and there were people with

456
00:18:06,909 --> 00:18:05,359
their notebooks and press cameras

457
00:18:09,399 --> 00:18:06,919
everything what's this about they were

458
00:18:11,169 --> 00:18:09,409
there for Andy and so it was amazing he

459
00:18:14,279 --> 00:18:11,179
went from being completely unknown to

460
00:18:17,049 --> 00:18:14,289
becoming famous and if you google google

461
00:18:18,909 --> 00:18:17,059
Don Lane Randy you come up with that

462
00:18:20,710 --> 00:18:18,919
segment it has been run and run and run

463
00:18:22,690 --> 00:18:20,720
and what it did for the skeptical

464
00:18:25,389 --> 00:18:22,700
movement was fantastic because it gave

465
00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:25,399
us this incredible publicity well

466
00:18:28,749 --> 00:18:26,690
there's a fascinating story about the

467
00:18:31,659 --> 00:18:28,759
check and pips home account what had

468
00:18:33,909 --> 00:18:31,669
happened this New Zealand millionaire he

469
00:18:36,249 --> 00:18:33,919
had this protege who could water Devine

470
00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:36,259
beautifully and Devine anything and he

471
00:18:41,289 --> 00:18:38,090
contacted me said can I send this person

472
00:18:43,720 --> 00:18:41,299
to Australia to win the $100,000 by then

473
00:18:45,609 --> 00:18:43,730
it was $100,000 that I came up with and

474
00:18:47,710 --> 00:18:45,619
so on the morning I had to go up to

475
00:18:49,210 --> 00:18:47,720
Gosford because it was a gospel radio

476
00:18:51,549 --> 00:18:49,220
station that was going to run the test

477
00:18:53,470 --> 00:18:51,559
and I remember saying to pick quick

478
00:18:55,149 --> 00:18:53,480
where's the checkbook and so she found

479
00:18:57,729 --> 00:18:55,159
her checkbook which was her home account

480
00:19:01,060 --> 00:18:57,739
and she said I was only got $250 in it

481
00:19:02,830 --> 00:19:01,070
so I wrote out the $100,000 check went

482
00:19:04,539 --> 00:19:02,840
up to Gosford and I said to the radio

483
00:19:06,399 --> 00:19:04,549
station manager because it was a total

484
00:19:07,570 --> 00:19:06,409
believer in water divining you are if

485
00:19:09,700 --> 00:19:07,580
you live in Gosford there's water

486
00:19:12,369 --> 00:19:09,710
everywhere and I handed in the check and

487
00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:12,379
I said you hand that check you decide

488
00:19:15,070 --> 00:19:13,730
who's the winner in your hand the check

489
00:19:17,379 --> 00:19:15,080
over hundred thousand dollars and he's

490
00:19:19,029 --> 00:19:17,389
shaky he says oh I've never held so much

491
00:19:21,430 --> 00:19:19,039
money in my life before and I thought if

492
00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:21,440
he only knew of course I would have come

493
00:19:23,990 --> 00:19:21,930
up with them

494
00:19:26,060 --> 00:19:24,000
but what happened this this guy had

495
00:19:27,980 --> 00:19:26,070
arrived from New Zealand he was

496
00:19:29,870 --> 00:19:27,990
demonstrating he had a brass door

497
00:19:31,580 --> 00:19:29,880
knocker and he kept putting it down on

498
00:19:33,260 --> 00:19:31,590
the ground and he'd walk around and the

499
00:19:35,660 --> 00:19:33,270
rods would been it was incredibly

500
00:19:39,110 --> 00:19:35,670
effective and I said look we were going

501
00:19:41,930 --> 00:19:39,120
to have 10 cardboard shoeboxes and I

502
00:19:43,850 --> 00:19:41,940
said what so we use your door knocker in

503
00:19:45,500 --> 00:19:43,860
the cardboard box and he couldn't

504
00:19:48,260 --> 00:19:45,510
believe it how could I be that fair I

505
00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:48,270
was gonna lose my money and so we put

506
00:19:52,910 --> 00:19:50,730
the the door knocker in the cardboard

507
00:19:54,410 --> 00:19:52,920
box first of all we get him to check

508
00:19:56,270 --> 00:19:54,420
without the door knocker is there any

509
00:19:58,460 --> 00:19:56,280
effect he got no effect with the 10

510
00:20:00,500 --> 00:19:58,470
cardboard boxes oh one stage he saw my

511
00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:00,510
briefcase he said can I move that

512
00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:02,850
further away he was convinced there was

513
00:20:06,500 --> 00:20:04,290
something in the briefcase because he

514
00:20:08,060 --> 00:20:06,510
thought how can this Dick Smith he's not

515
00:20:09,860 --> 00:20:08,070
gonna lose his hundred thousand dollars

516
00:20:11,930 --> 00:20:09,870
there must be something going to stop me

517
00:20:14,270 --> 00:20:11,940
from winning so we moved the brief

518
00:20:15,980 --> 00:20:14,280
briefcase then I said now we're going to

519
00:20:17,630 --> 00:20:15,990
put the brass knocker in when other

520
00:20:19,040 --> 00:20:17,640
boxes and you shows you get the ready

521
00:20:21,140 --> 00:20:19,050
he said I'll it's not necessary and I

522
00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:21,150
said yes it is it's part of the protocol

523
00:20:24,980 --> 00:20:23,610
set by James Randi so we then put the

524
00:20:26,690 --> 00:20:24,990
brass knocker in box number two and he

525
00:20:28,910 --> 00:20:26,700
goes along and box number two he's

526
00:20:30,290 --> 00:20:28,920
pulling the rods it's just unbelievable

527
00:20:32,990 --> 00:20:30,300
the pulling power when you know it's

528
00:20:35,570 --> 00:20:33,000
there so I said now what we'll do and we

529
00:20:37,550 --> 00:20:35,580
had 10 little disks in a bag and I said

530
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:37,560
I'll go away and I said you'll go away

531
00:20:42,110 --> 00:20:40,050
they'll then randomly put they'll take a

532
00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:42,120
disc out between 1 and 10 and then put

533
00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:45,090
the brass doorknocker in one of the 10

534
00:20:48,890 --> 00:20:47,490
cardboard boxes then that person will go

535
00:20:51,110 --> 00:20:48,900
away and then you'll come along and

536
00:20:52,970 --> 00:20:51,120
you'll divine which one it's in well of

537
00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:52,980
course what happened he went I think he

538
00:20:57,200 --> 00:20:55,410
magically got less than 1 in 10 I find

539
00:21:00,320 --> 00:20:57,210
this quite often happens and so

540
00:21:01,850 --> 00:21:00,330
unfortunately he failed now I must tell

541
00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:01,860
you another story I'm here in the house

542
00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:04,290
here and there's a knock on the door and

543
00:21:09,500 --> 00:21:07,890
this gentleman about 75 years of age did

544
00:21:12,620 --> 00:21:09,510
come all the way from Melbourne to win

545
00:21:14,030 --> 00:21:12,630
the $100,000 and he knocked on the door

546
00:21:15,590 --> 00:21:14,040
and he had written to me and I said no

547
00:21:17,120 --> 00:21:15,600
look I don't want to spend any more time

548
00:21:20,090 --> 00:21:17,130
I don't want to waste your time so he

549
00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:20,100
came over with his wife and he as I

550
00:21:24,110 --> 00:21:22,170
opened the door he he threw a dollar

551
00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:24,120
note down on the ground he said look at

552
00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:25,770
this and he's got his divining write

553
00:21:29,810 --> 00:21:27,690
down and though the dollar note is

554
00:21:32,180 --> 00:21:29,820
pulling the divining rods I said ok so

555
00:21:34,970 --> 00:21:32,190
we went and got the 10 cardboard boxes

556
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:34,980
and he didn't even pass the first test

557
00:21:37,670 --> 00:21:36,210
because

558
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:37,680
we did the test there was no reading

559
00:21:41,690 --> 00:21:39,690
when there was nothing in it so then he

560
00:21:43,610 --> 00:21:41,700
put I said now you've got to put the

561
00:21:45,830 --> 00:21:43,620
dollar in one of the boxes and show that

562
00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:45,840
it works when the lids on the box so he

563
00:21:49,940 --> 00:21:48,210
put the dollar in box number three said

564
00:21:53,210 --> 00:21:49,950
it done then goes up and down in

565
00:21:56,060 --> 00:21:53,220
Divine's at his box number four and his

566
00:21:58,150 --> 00:21:56,070
wife said darling remember what box you

567
00:22:00,530 --> 00:21:58,160
put it in she kept repeating this and

568
00:22:02,420 --> 00:22:00,540
eventually as I said it's definitely box

569
00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:02,430
number four is it yes yes Paul is

570
00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:03,930
pulling like that so he lifts the lid

571
00:22:08,810 --> 00:22:05,970
it's not there because it was in box

572
00:22:11,420 --> 00:22:08,820
number three and what it showed is to me

573
00:22:13,340 --> 00:22:11,430
how genuine I've never yet met a

574
00:22:16,310 --> 00:22:13,350
fraudulent person when it comes to

575
00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:16,320
claiming the $100,000 already now as I

576
00:22:19,730 --> 00:22:18,330
think a million dollars I've never met a

577
00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:19,740
fraudulent person when it comes to the

578
00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:23,090
divining tests yes with some other about

579
00:22:28,610 --> 00:22:25,650
contests I have but the divining tests

580
00:22:31,370 --> 00:22:28,620
have been genuinely genuinely believed

581
00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:31,380
is in their ability which they've never

582
00:22:34,850 --> 00:22:32,970
been able to show to any person who

583
00:22:37,310 --> 00:22:34,860
gives us a bit of rational thinking it

584
00:22:40,220 --> 00:22:37,320
simply doesn't work it's ideomotor

585
00:22:43,550 --> 00:22:40,230
reaction if you think it's there it's

586
00:22:47,510 --> 00:22:43,560
there I must tell you another story um

587
00:22:51,650 --> 00:22:47,520
in England there is the English dowels

588
00:22:53,990 --> 00:22:51,660
of society and I became a member they

589
00:22:55,850 --> 00:22:54,000
did not as a skeptic and one day they

590
00:22:59,410 --> 00:22:55,860
sent me their magazine and they said

591
00:23:02,600 --> 00:22:59,420
we're having a contest here is a map and

592
00:23:05,570 --> 00:23:02,610
there's a gold in gold mine on one bit

593
00:23:08,030 --> 00:23:05,580
of a map please send to please do tells

594
00:23:11,540 --> 00:23:08,040
it with your pendulum and market where

595
00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:11,550
it is and the person closest to the gold

596
00:23:16,310 --> 00:23:14,010
will win an award from the English

597
00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:16,320
dowsing Society I thought fantastic I

598
00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:17,610
got in touch with ready I said let's

599
00:23:20,540 --> 00:23:19,170
watch this and so we waited and waited

600
00:23:22,430 --> 00:23:20,550
and waited we put in a couple of

601
00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:22,440
entrance ourselves and then they came

602
00:23:27,230 --> 00:23:23,970
back and they brought it their magazine

603
00:23:29,300 --> 00:23:27,240
they said oh we've cancelled the contest

604
00:23:31,370 --> 00:23:29,310
because they said something weird has

605
00:23:34,220 --> 00:23:31,380
happened and everything's been corrupted

606
00:23:36,980 --> 00:23:34,230
and we just got random marks all across

607
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:36,990
the map of where the gold was so it had

608
00:23:42,290 --> 00:23:39,930
no effect on their belief that maybe

609
00:23:44,150 --> 00:23:42,300
their belief is wrong and you can't dows

610
00:23:46,250 --> 00:23:44,160
a map I mean if you have anything so

611
00:23:48,290 --> 00:23:46,260
ridiculous you get a pendulum on a map

612
00:23:49,270 --> 00:23:48,300
to design where a gold mine is by the

613
00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:49,280
way

614
00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:52,130
the skepticism movement is important

615
00:23:56,890 --> 00:23:53,690
because from time to time and a good

616
00:23:59,380 --> 00:23:56,900
example would be the immunization

617
00:24:01,690 --> 00:23:59,390
movement we ended up with a situation I

618
00:24:04,419 --> 00:24:01,700
got back involved again where there was

619
00:24:06,100 --> 00:24:04,429
a quite extraordinary organization

620
00:24:07,960 --> 00:24:06,110
called the Australian vaccination

621
00:24:10,630 --> 00:24:07,970
Network now in fact they were anti

622
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:10,640
vaccination they had completely deluded

623
00:24:15,039 --> 00:24:12,770
themselves into believing the things you

624
00:24:17,140 --> 00:24:15,049
hear that vaccination causes autism and

625
00:24:19,029 --> 00:24:17,150
all of these claims that have been shown

626
00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:19,039
to have no evidence but they were quite

627
00:24:23,890 --> 00:24:21,650
influential and so I got involved again

628
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:23,900
being sort of a public figure and I was

629
00:24:27,430 --> 00:24:25,610
able to get out there and say look

630
00:24:30,700 --> 00:24:27,440
please vaccinate your children they're

631
00:24:32,529 --> 00:24:30,710
going to die and it taught me again that

632
00:24:34,210 --> 00:24:32,539
we have to be very careful in society

633
00:24:35,950 --> 00:24:34,220
because especially with modern

634
00:24:38,649 --> 00:24:35,960
communications the internet and so forth

635
00:24:42,460 --> 00:24:38,659
that you can send out something either a

636
00:24:45,820 --> 00:24:42,470
hoax in the case of that Randy opera

637
00:24:48,220 --> 00:24:45,830
house stunt or genuinely deluded people

638
00:24:50,860 --> 00:24:48,230
and the genuinely deluded people are

639
00:24:52,870 --> 00:24:50,870
many ways the most dangerous to society

640
00:24:56,950 --> 00:24:52,880
because they can get large followings

641
00:24:58,539 --> 00:24:56,960
because they're so genuine and my my

642
00:25:01,029 --> 00:24:58,549
attitude on this by the way is that we

643
00:25:02,890 --> 00:25:01,039
trust doctors to do heart transplants

644
00:25:05,260 --> 00:25:02,900
well I reckon I'm gonna trust them to

645
00:25:07,180 --> 00:25:05,270
tell me whether a vaccination is safe or

646
00:25:08,860 --> 00:25:07,190
not the other thing we've got to be

647
00:25:12,580 --> 00:25:08,870
communicating is that everything has

648
00:25:15,700 --> 00:25:12,590
risk this tends to be forgotten and yes

649
00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:15,710
you get you go into an operation you

650
00:25:19,779 --> 00:25:17,330
have a full anaesthetic and there's a

651
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:19,789
one in 50,000 some people claim one in

652
00:25:23,380 --> 00:25:21,650
$500,000 you will die from the

653
00:25:25,149 --> 00:25:23,390
anaesthetic but that doesn't mean to say

654
00:25:27,490 --> 00:25:25,159
you don't get operated on for a heart

655
00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:27,500
problem or a lung problem cancer all of

656
00:25:30,610 --> 00:25:29,210
those things people have got to

657
00:25:32,919 --> 00:25:30,620
understand that there's risk with

658
00:25:35,370 --> 00:25:32,929
everything but it's the balance what's

659
00:25:38,770 --> 00:25:35,380
the chance of you dying from this

660
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:38,780
injection - compared to what's the

661
00:25:41,890 --> 00:25:40,610
chance of you having a good life because

662
00:25:48,649 --> 00:25:41,900
you've had the injection and your

663
00:25:53,549 --> 00:25:51,479
you can see more of that interview with

664
00:25:55,950 --> 00:25:53,559
dick Smith by following the link on this

665
00:25:59,190 --> 00:25:55,960
week's show notes and other interviews

666
00:26:11,510 --> 00:25:59,200
about the history of Australian skeptics

667
00:26:13,700 --> 00:26:11,520
[Music]

668
00:26:15,470 --> 00:26:13,710
hiya folks Maynard here and I'll be

669
00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:15,480
conducting very special interviews with

670
00:26:21,530 --> 00:26:17,730
Richard Saunders and other people at

671
00:26:22,450 --> 00:26:21,540
skeptic Con in Melbourne I say it

672
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:22,460
Melbourne

673
00:26:28,910 --> 00:26:26,730
and people who talk a lot and there will

674
00:26:31,850 --> 00:26:28,920
be a lot of talking going on at skeptic

675
00:26:34,310 --> 00:26:31,860
on in fact a magic going and studying at

676
00:26:36,590 --> 00:26:34,320
some tertiary institution for many many

677
00:26:37,610 --> 00:26:36,600
years only to find yourself in Melbourne

678
00:26:39,260 --> 00:26:37,620
being interviewed by me

679
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:39,270
hardly the academic reward you would

680
00:26:42,169 --> 00:26:40,530
like but that will be happening in

681
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:42,179
December as Richard Saunders and myself

682
00:26:46,790 --> 00:26:45,090
just completely blitz the record for how

683
00:26:48,799 --> 00:26:46,800
many interviews we can do in a 24 hour

684
00:26:50,540 --> 00:26:48,809
period or even a 48 hour period and

685
00:26:53,030 --> 00:26:50,550
that's quite a lot and this time we're

686
00:26:55,430 --> 00:26:53,040
gonna go for quite a lot more that's

687
00:26:58,310 --> 00:26:55,440
that skeptic on be there in December in

688
00:26:59,900 --> 00:26:58,320
Melbourne I'm standing here with a bad

689
00:27:14,340 --> 00:26:59,910
haircut in an even worse suit

690
00:27:19,870 --> 00:27:17,290
on the sceptic zone podcast over many

691
00:27:22,540 --> 00:27:19,880
years and right now and we have tackled

692
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:22,550
the issue look at the issue examined the

693
00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:28,010
issue of one of the most bizarre forms

694
00:27:32,860 --> 00:27:31,010
of quackery I have ever seen and the

695
00:27:33,910 --> 00:27:32,870
first time I saw this particular piece

696
00:27:37,690 --> 00:27:33,920
of whooo

697
00:27:41,430 --> 00:27:37,700
I had to look twice because I could not

698
00:27:44,410 --> 00:27:41,440
believe what I was seeing ear candling

699
00:27:47,440 --> 00:27:44,420
for those of you who may not know this

700
00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:47,450
is where you get a little candle or I

701
00:27:57,160 --> 00:27:53,050
should say it's more like a tube of wax

702
00:28:00,340 --> 00:27:57,170
in the shape of a candle you stick one

703
00:28:04,150 --> 00:28:00,350
in in your ear while lying down on your

704
00:28:06,220 --> 00:28:04,160
side and the other end is lit the

705
00:28:09,850 --> 00:28:06,230
thinking behind it if thinking is the

706
00:28:15,040 --> 00:28:09,860
right term is that the flame will cause

707
00:28:18,490 --> 00:28:15,050
a vacuum up the tube of the air candle a

708
00:28:22,890 --> 00:28:18,500
hollow inside this vacuum will draw out

709
00:28:26,410 --> 00:28:22,900
wax from your ear now not only is this

710
00:28:28,150 --> 00:28:26,420
scientifically implausible in fact or

711
00:28:31,120 --> 00:28:28,160
the vacuum to do that would probably

712
00:28:33,100 --> 00:28:31,130
perforate your eardrum anyway it's

713
00:28:35,760 --> 00:28:33,110
physically not possible it doesn't work

714
00:28:39,100 --> 00:28:35,770
the little flame at the end of the

715
00:28:40,270 --> 00:28:39,110
candle does not create such a vacuum but

716
00:28:41,920 --> 00:28:40,280
then we get all the other new-age

717
00:28:44,890 --> 00:28:41,930
garbage which is normally made with

718
00:28:47,410 --> 00:28:44,900
similar things it will give you a peace

719
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:47,420
of mind it will balance your energies it

720
00:28:54,490 --> 00:28:51,250
will draw out other toxins and so on

721
00:28:56,710 --> 00:28:54,500
it's a spiritual thing to do maybe the

722
00:29:00,490 --> 00:28:56,720
reality is of course that these things

723
00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:00,500
are dangerous and they have no known

724
00:29:06,970 --> 00:29:04,370
medical benefits the danger comes in

725
00:29:09,730 --> 00:29:06,980
sticking a candle in your ear which can

726
00:29:13,330 --> 00:29:09,740
result in hot wax dripping down into the

727
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:13,340
ear canal so it's good to see that once

728
00:29:18,549 --> 00:29:16,250
again once again our good friends at the

729
00:29:21,460 --> 00:29:18,559
good thinking Society

730
00:29:24,159 --> 00:29:21,470
I've stepped up to the plate fronted up

731
00:29:26,860 --> 00:29:24,169
to bat at the crease for science and

732
00:29:30,639 --> 00:29:26,870
reason and here's a press release from

733
00:29:36,369 --> 00:29:30,649
the good thinking society in the UK of

734
00:29:39,369 --> 00:29:36,379
course dated November the 19th 2019 BBC

735
00:29:44,049 --> 00:29:39,379
upholds our complaints against Claudia

736
00:29:47,529 --> 00:29:44,059
tries dot dot dot ear candling this post

737
00:29:49,840 --> 00:29:47,539
is by Laura Thomason the BBC's executive

738
00:29:53,739 --> 00:29:49,850
complaint unit has upheld our complaint

739
00:29:57,009 --> 00:29:53,749
against quote Claudia tries dot dot dot

740
00:29:59,440 --> 00:29:57,019
ear candling in quote a short video

741
00:30:02,710 --> 00:29:59,450
which appeared on the Glasgow based

742
00:30:04,690 --> 00:30:02,720
digital platform the social we are

743
00:30:07,029 --> 00:30:04,700
concerned that the video gave the

744
00:30:10,269 --> 00:30:07,039
misleading impression that ear candling

745
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:10,279
is both effective and safe the presenter

746
00:30:16,659 --> 00:30:13,850
Claudia Scott said ear candles are known

747
00:30:19,119 --> 00:30:16,669
for drawing out impurities clearing

748
00:30:21,340 --> 00:30:19,129
pressure and relieving sinuses

749
00:30:23,859 --> 00:30:21,350
she also said she would recommend this

750
00:30:25,509 --> 00:30:23,869
as an alternative to ear syringing for

751
00:30:28,899 --> 00:30:25,519
anyone who was worried about having

752
00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:28,909
their ears syringe now as an aside I

753
00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:31,730
will say that many years ago I was

754
00:30:36,850 --> 00:30:34,490
suffering from ear problems after

755
00:30:39,779 --> 00:30:36,860
swimming the water wouldn't all drain

756
00:30:42,460 --> 00:30:39,789
out from my ears it was very annoying

757
00:30:44,649 --> 00:30:42,470
finally I went to the doctor for an

758
00:30:47,889 --> 00:30:44,659
examination and lo and behold I had some

759
00:30:50,889 --> 00:30:47,899
blockage in this and wax a quick syringe

760
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:50,899
and my problems were fixed it was

761
00:30:58,480 --> 00:30:55,570
remarkable we read on the BBC ECU

762
00:31:00,970 --> 00:30:58,490
concluded there is no evidence that ear

763
00:31:04,090 --> 00:31:00,980
candling is an effective treatment for

764
00:31:06,129 --> 00:31:04,100
any condition and the website version of

765
00:31:09,070 --> 00:31:06,139
the item though not it's Facebook

766
00:31:11,259 --> 00:31:09,080
iteration was accompanied by text

767
00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:11,269
stating the NHS view was that the

768
00:31:17,980 --> 00:31:13,730
practice was not supported by evidence

769
00:31:20,070 --> 00:31:17,990
and that sinus / ear problems should be

770
00:31:23,049 --> 00:31:20,080
referred to a doctor or pharmacist

771
00:31:25,239 --> 00:31:23,059
however this was entirely offset by

772
00:31:27,700 --> 00:31:25,249
comments from the presenter which

773
00:31:30,549 --> 00:31:27,710
recommended the treatment and endorsed

774
00:31:32,590 --> 00:31:30,559
claims for its effects the head of

775
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:32,600
editorial standards Scott

776
00:31:36,580 --> 00:31:34,490
has discussed with the team the

777
00:31:38,889 --> 00:31:36,590
importance of accuracy in items which

778
00:31:41,019 --> 00:31:38,899
feature or make reference to practices

779
00:31:43,299 --> 00:31:41,029
which might be harmful we would suggest

780
00:31:45,810 --> 00:31:43,309
that any subject relating to health or

781
00:31:48,310 --> 00:31:45,820
medicine would require careful

782
00:31:51,639 --> 00:31:48,320
consideration and is unlikely to be

783
00:31:54,759 --> 00:31:51,649
suitable for a light-hearted quote

784
00:31:57,100 --> 00:31:54,769
lifestyle in quote feature presenting

785
00:31:59,710 --> 00:31:57,110
Fringe ideas and treatments in this way

786
00:32:01,690 --> 00:31:59,720
gives the audience a wholly misleading

787
00:32:04,539 --> 00:32:01,700
impression that can lead them to make

788
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:04,549
unwise and even dangerous health

789
00:32:15,810 --> 00:32:11,090
decisions so once again three cheers for

790
00:32:18,580 --> 00:32:15,820
the good thinking society in the UK and

791
00:32:21,370 --> 00:32:18,590
well as I said in a recent Twitter post

792
00:32:24,070 --> 00:32:21,380
you can follow the skeptics out on

793
00:32:26,289 --> 00:32:24,080
Twitter at the skeptic zone to Aldi

794
00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:26,299
supermarkets here in Australia who were

795
00:32:33,009 --> 00:32:28,970
selling ear candles although they ended

796
00:32:36,519 --> 00:32:33,019
up in the bargain cabinet marked down

797
00:32:38,259 --> 00:32:36,529
I said words to the effect that the ear

798
00:32:41,530 --> 00:32:38,269
candles don't belong in the bargain

799
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:41,540
section they belong into the Beermen a

800
00:32:45,639 --> 00:32:43,330
[Music]

801
00:32:47,740 --> 00:32:45,649
link to this story from the good

802
00:32:57,250 --> 00:32:47,750
thinking society in this week's show

803
00:32:57,260 --> 00:33:04,310
[Music]

804
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:11,160
[Applause]

805
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:15,610
hey Richard oh hi Trish hi would you

806
00:33:18,370 --> 00:33:16,490
like a coffee

807
00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:18,380
yeah thanks what are you working on I'm

808
00:33:23,140 --> 00:33:20,210
trying to come up with a new promo to

809
00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:23,150
play on the sceptic zone is it for the

810
00:33:28,480 --> 00:33:25,970
good thinking society in the UK you know

811
00:33:30,100 --> 00:33:28,490
the oh yeah I know them the guys who

812
00:33:32,230 --> 00:33:30,110
recently chased the homeopaths out of

813
00:33:34,150 --> 00:33:32,240
the UK public health system oh did they

814
00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:34,160
yeah they campaigned and lobbied

815
00:33:38,470 --> 00:33:35,330
government for a while and now you

816
00:33:39,820 --> 00:33:38,480
cannot get homeopathy on the NHS so they

817
00:33:41,830 --> 00:33:39,830
can now spend public money on health

818
00:33:44,170 --> 00:33:41,840
care that works Yeah right look I'll

819
00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:44,180
mention that in the promo now their

820
00:33:50,590 --> 00:33:48,770
website is good thinking society org and

821
00:33:52,090 --> 00:33:50,600
that website is a good resource for

822
00:33:54,100 --> 00:33:52,100
learning more about quackery

823
00:33:55,490 --> 00:33:54,110
thanks Trish that gives me something

824
00:34:09,580 --> 00:33:55,500
good to think about

825
00:34:15,830 --> 00:34:13,700
you may remember I interviewed a very

826
00:34:19,100 --> 00:34:15,840
young war I met at DragonCon by the name

827
00:34:22,460 --> 00:34:19,110
of Bailey Harris now this was on show

828
00:34:28,010 --> 00:34:22,470
number five seven one on the 22nd of

829
00:34:30,770 --> 00:34:28,020
September this year Bailey is an author

830
00:34:32,030 --> 00:34:30,780
speaker and advocate for free thought

831
00:34:34,190 --> 00:34:32,040
and human rights

832
00:34:38,390 --> 00:34:34,200
now she wrote a series of books called

833
00:34:40,970 --> 00:34:38,400
Stardust about the history of well

834
00:34:42,020 --> 00:34:40,980
everything the universe life on Earth

835
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:42,030
all that sort of thing

836
00:34:49,250 --> 00:34:44,610
directed at children so in the past week

837
00:34:53,570 --> 00:34:49,260
I got word from Bailey that a video has

838
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:53,580
been made of her adventure visiting Ark

839
00:34:58,040 --> 00:34:56,010
Encounter in Kentucky in the United

840
00:35:01,310 --> 00:34:58,050
States now for those of you who may not

841
00:35:05,870 --> 00:35:01,320
know the Ark Encounter is a giant

842
00:35:08,090 --> 00:35:05,880
replica of yes Noah's Ark and you can

843
00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:08,100
wander through Noah's Ark and look at

844
00:35:13,130 --> 00:35:10,650
all the animals in the pens or replica

845
00:35:17,740 --> 00:35:13,140
animals in replica pens learn all about

846
00:35:20,150 --> 00:35:17,750
the true history of the universe as

847
00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:20,160
revealed in the pages of the Old

848
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:23,610
Testament but maybe more importantly for

849
00:35:29,300 --> 00:35:26,490
us you can see Bailey's visit to the Ark

850
00:35:31,850 --> 00:35:29,310
Encounter via a youtube video now the

851
00:35:34,670 --> 00:35:31,860
information accompanying says what

852
00:35:37,780 --> 00:35:34,680
better way to spend Easter weekend than

853
00:35:41,090 --> 00:35:37,790
to take a tour of the Ark Encounter and

854
00:35:44,450 --> 00:35:41,100
expose the anti-science that it bleeds

855
00:35:46,930 --> 00:35:44,460
from every pore this is just what author

856
00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:46,940
and secular activists Bailey Harris

857
00:35:51,890 --> 00:35:49,170
partnered with the secular Student

858
00:35:53,570 --> 00:35:51,900
Alliance to do earlier this year now I

859
00:35:55,220 --> 00:35:53,580
think this is something the skeptic soda

860
00:35:58,130 --> 00:35:55,230
audience will find very interesting

861
00:36:01,250 --> 00:35:58,140
amusing a little bit frightening the

862
00:36:04,310 --> 00:36:01,260
video is called secular tour of the Ark

863
00:36:07,220 --> 00:36:04,320
Encounter atheist Bailey Harris versus

864
00:36:09,140 --> 00:36:07,230
fundamentalist Ken Ham and I'll

865
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:09,150
certainly link to that video on this

866
00:36:12,740 --> 00:36:10,770
week's show notes so you can check it

867
00:36:15,350 --> 00:36:12,750
out for yourself but I thought I'd play

868
00:36:18,090 --> 00:36:15,360
a few moments of highlights

869
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:18,100
hello everyone this is Bailey Harris and

870
00:36:24,240 --> 00:36:19,930
I'm a secular activists and the author

871
00:36:26,250 --> 00:36:24,250
of the Stardust bug series thank you to

872
00:36:28,500 --> 00:36:26,260
secular state lines for partnering with

873
00:36:31,740 --> 00:36:28,510
me to do a secular tour of the Ark

874
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:31,750
Encounter there is no better way to

875
00:36:36,270 --> 00:36:33,970
spend Easter weekend than taking a trip

876
00:36:42,300 --> 00:36:36,280
to the great state of Kentucky to see

877
00:36:44,550 --> 00:36:42,310
anti science at its best tickets are

878
00:36:47,400 --> 00:36:44,560
expensive fifty one dollars for adults

879
00:36:49,620 --> 00:36:47,410
and twenty seven dollars for children we

880
00:36:51,600 --> 00:36:49,630
hated giving them our money but we hope

881
00:36:54,390 --> 00:36:51,610
that this helps many of you experience

882
00:36:57,630 --> 00:36:54,400
arc without having to go yourself the

883
00:37:01,350 --> 00:36:57,640
Ark Encounter opened in 2016 in Kentucky

884
00:37:03,420 --> 00:37:01,360
it is 510 feet long and over 50 feet

885
00:37:05,730 --> 00:37:03,430
high the Ark Encounter is operated by

886
00:37:08,220 --> 00:37:05,740
Answers in Genesis the anti science

887
00:37:10,110 --> 00:37:08,230
young earth creationist group they spent

888
00:37:12,390 --> 00:37:10,120
over 100 million dollars to build the

889
00:37:14,460 --> 00:37:12,400
ark and they received significant tax

890
00:37:16,470 --> 00:37:14,470
incentives from the city county and

891
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:16,480
state where's the church-state

892
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:20,170
separation the fairy tale of Noah's Ark

893
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:22,330
is found in the Old Testament it tells

894
00:37:26,310 --> 00:37:24,490
the story of a 500 year old man named

895
00:37:28,610 --> 00:37:26,320
Noah and his family who lived on earth

896
00:37:31,260 --> 00:37:28,620
four thousand three hundred years ago

897
00:37:34,020 --> 00:37:31,270
supposedly only a couple of thousand

898
00:37:35,790 --> 00:37:34,030
years after earth formed their God was

899
00:37:38,700 --> 00:37:35,800
upset because the people living on earth

900
00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:38,710
had become so wicked God said in Genesis

901
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:42,010
6 I will destroy from the earth people

902
00:37:47,190 --> 00:37:44,170
I've created and with them the animals

903
00:37:49,350 --> 00:37:47,200
birds in creeping things Noah was the

904
00:37:51,630 --> 00:37:49,360
most righteous person living on earth so

905
00:37:53,490 --> 00:37:51,640
I made a deal with God that he and his

906
00:37:58,620 --> 00:37:53,500
family wouldn't be murdered in this mass

907
00:38:00,090 --> 00:37:58,630
genocide oh man I love this snake this

908
00:38:01,750 --> 00:38:00,100
is the truest

909
00:38:04,450 --> 00:38:01,760
in this place

910
00:38:06,430 --> 00:38:04,460
if I can convince you that the flood was

911
00:38:09,190 --> 00:38:06,440
not real then I can convince you that

912
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:09,200
heaven and hell are not real I'm making

913
00:38:19,210 --> 00:38:17,330
us my mantra the experience of visiting

914
00:38:22,330 --> 00:38:19,220
the Ark Encounter was very surreal to me

915
00:38:24,910 --> 00:38:22,340
the size of magnificence is actually

916
00:38:26,560 --> 00:38:24,920
rather inspiring but this magnificence

917
00:38:29,470 --> 00:38:26,570
makes it even more dangerous for

918
00:38:32,050 --> 00:38:29,480
children this attraction is anti-science

919
00:38:34,090 --> 00:38:32,060
at every corner and I left with an even

920
00:38:35,859 --> 00:38:34,100
stronger understanding of why we need to

921
00:38:38,109 --> 00:38:35,869
all fight for science education and

922
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:38,119
truth I hope that you can all join me in

923
00:38:45,010 --> 00:38:43,130
continuing this fight so there you go

924
00:38:47,950 --> 00:38:45,020
check out the video for yourself and see

925
00:38:50,980 --> 00:38:47,960
what Bailey Harris gets up to in the

926
00:38:59,800 --> 00:38:50,990
replica of Noah's Ark

927
00:39:10,650 --> 00:39:06,780
[Music]

928
00:39:17,259 --> 00:39:14,620
dr. Harriet Hall MD known to thousands

929
00:39:19,539 --> 00:39:17,269
as the skeptic a retired family

930
00:39:22,029 --> 00:39:19,549
physician and former Air Force flight

931
00:39:23,980 --> 00:39:22,039
surgeon she writes about medicine

932
00:39:27,579 --> 00:39:23,990
so-called complementary and alternative

933
00:39:30,970 --> 00:39:27,589
medicine science quackery and critical

934
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:30,980
thinking Harriet now has a free course a

935
00:39:35,680 --> 00:39:33,170
series of ten video lectures on

936
00:39:38,319 --> 00:39:35,690
science-based medicine and alternative

937
00:39:40,660 --> 00:39:38,329
medicine the videos and an accompanying

938
00:39:44,339 --> 00:39:40,670
course guide can be found by following

939
00:39:49,359 --> 00:39:44,349
the link at skeptic info or by visiting

940
00:39:53,710 --> 00:39:49,369
web Randi's org slash educational -

941
00:39:56,829 --> 00:39:53,720
modules dot html' topics covered in the

942
00:39:58,120 --> 00:39:56,839
series are science-based medicine vs.

943
00:40:01,829 --> 00:39:58,130
evidence-based medicine

944
00:40:05,140 --> 00:40:01,839
what is Kam chiropractic acupuncture

945
00:40:07,930 --> 00:40:05,150
homeopathy naturopathy and herbal

946
00:40:10,630 --> 00:40:07,940
medicine energy medicine miscellaneous

947
00:40:13,630 --> 00:40:10,640
alternatives pitfalls in research and

948
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:13,640
science based medicine in the media and

949
00:40:17,529 --> 00:40:15,130
politics

950
00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:17,539
Harriett covers each topic in a

951
00:40:23,230 --> 00:40:19,970
matter-of-fact no-nonsense way that

952
00:40:25,330 --> 00:40:23,240
shorter educate and entertain skeptic

953
00:40:43,530 --> 00:40:25,340
dot info

954
00:40:46,720 --> 00:40:43,540
[Music]

955
00:40:49,420 --> 00:40:46,730
hi my name's Tim Mendham I'm executive

956
00:40:53,140 --> 00:40:49,430
officer Australian skeptics and editor

957
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:53,150
of the skeptic magazine today we're

958
00:41:00,070 --> 00:40:56,090
looking once again at the hole in the

959
00:41:01,900 --> 00:41:00,080
pole this is the story other suppose it

960
00:41:04,830 --> 00:41:01,910
holes into the underground under the

961
00:41:07,060 --> 00:41:04,840
earth but who knows lives and dwells

962
00:41:09,070 --> 00:41:07,070
previously we looked at the history of

963
00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:09,080
some of these holes including the

964
00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:11,690
efforts by the Nazis to find one and

965
00:41:17,620 --> 00:41:15,170
populate it and also the issue of photos

966
00:41:20,830 --> 00:41:17,630
that have supposed at least shown the

967
00:41:21,610 --> 00:41:20,840
holes in the poles they haven't let me

968
00:41:24,850 --> 00:41:21,620
explain why

969
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:24,860
but in this third part we will look at

970
00:41:29,830 --> 00:41:26,330
the people who have tried to go there

971
00:41:32,350 --> 00:41:29,840
and the adventures that they've had in

972
00:41:35,650 --> 00:41:32,360
their efforts which have not generally

973
00:41:37,360 --> 00:41:35,660
been very successful so this is the hole

974
00:41:43,690 --> 00:41:37,370
in the pole from the skeptic magazine

975
00:41:51,490 --> 00:41:43,700
March 2018 vol 38 number one we call

976
00:41:54,570 --> 00:41:51,500
this section the Clough links a no

977
00:41:57,060 --> 00:41:54,580
discussion of holders

978
00:41:59,670 --> 00:41:57,070
believers in conspiracies of holes in

979
00:42:02,250 --> 00:41:59,680
the poles would be complete without the

980
00:42:03,050 --> 00:42:02,260
salutary lessons of a leading proponent

981
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:03,060
of the Hollow Earth

982
00:42:11,430 --> 00:42:07,330
Rodney Clough author of world top secret

983
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:11,440
our earth is hollow cliff knows the

984
00:42:15,810 --> 00:42:14,170
holes well he says my latest best

985
00:42:18,540 --> 00:42:15,820
estimate of the size of the polar

986
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:18,550
openings that they are 840 miles in

987
00:42:22,590 --> 00:42:20,530
diameter where they start to dip into

988
00:42:25,170 --> 00:42:22,600
the earth and at the neck of the parlor

989
00:42:27,150 --> 00:42:25,180
openings are 40 miles in diameter the

990
00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:27,160
North Polar opening is located in

991
00:42:33,990 --> 00:42:30,610
Northland Russia at 84.8 for north

992
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:34,000
latitude 129 east longitude the south

993
00:42:38,900 --> 00:42:36,010
polar opening is on the exact opposite

994
00:42:43,890 --> 00:42:38,910
of the globe at 84.8 for south latitude

995
00:42:45,830 --> 00:42:43,900
51 west longitude now let's be precise

996
00:42:48,510 --> 00:42:45,840
and we hope it comes true

997
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:48,520
whilst ort of the UK Telegraph wrote a

998
00:42:54,060 --> 00:42:50,170
long article on the history of hollow

999
00:42:57,600 --> 00:42:54,070
earthers in 2014 and Clough story

1000
00:42:59,370 --> 00:42:57,610
featured pretty prominently it turned

1001
00:43:01,050 --> 00:42:59,380
out the Clough is a longtime fanatic of

1002
00:43:03,180 --> 00:43:01,060
the Hollow Earth so much so that in the

1003
00:43:06,000 --> 00:43:03,190
1980s he'd moved his family from New

1004
00:43:09,030 --> 00:43:06,010
Mexico to Alaska so they could be near

1005
00:43:12,720 --> 00:43:09,040
the hole and perhaps find it much to his

1006
00:43:14,850 --> 00:43:12,730
wife's chagrin in Alaska store relates

1007
00:43:16,920 --> 00:43:14,860
Clough made a small group of people who

1008
00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:16,930
had traveled to the icy state with the

1009
00:43:22,380 --> 00:43:19,690
same idea soon they were ready to embark

1010
00:43:24,900 --> 00:43:22,390
upon their mission we started on the

1011
00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:24,910
road up to Point Barrow Clough said we

1012
00:43:30,660 --> 00:43:27,490
saw a sign at one point saying this is a

1013
00:43:35,720 --> 00:43:30,670
private road don't go any further so we

1014
00:43:38,340 --> 00:43:35,730
didn't go any further they turned back

1015
00:43:41,130 --> 00:43:38,350
store asked how long they had driven

1016
00:43:44,510 --> 00:43:41,140
before they reached the sign and aborted

1017
00:43:46,650 --> 00:43:44,520
the mission about an hour Clough said

1018
00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:46,660
soon afterwards the Clough family moved

1019
00:43:52,560 --> 00:43:49,930
back south of course Clough didn't stop

1020
00:43:54,030 --> 00:43:52,570
there he was so confident in theory that

1021
00:43:56,220 --> 00:43:54,040
he organized a tourist voyage to the

1022
00:43:58,370 --> 00:43:56,230
Hollow Earth with a plan to set off from

1023
00:44:02,430 --> 00:43:58,380
Russia on an icebreaker

1024
00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:02,440
in June 2007 to find the hole in the

1025
00:44:07,710 --> 00:44:05,170
pole make him look at this on voyage

1026
00:44:08,460 --> 00:44:07,720
Hollow Earth calm the vessel was the

1027
00:44:10,950 --> 00:44:08,470
Russian nuclear

1028
00:44:13,770 --> 00:44:10,960
powered icebreaker Yamal a modern ship

1029
00:44:16,470 --> 00:44:13,780
capable of carrying 108 passengers with

1030
00:44:19,410 --> 00:44:16,480
all mod cons as the promotion for the

1031
00:44:21,510 --> 00:44:19,420
trip said quote the vessel accommodates

1032
00:44:23,609 --> 00:44:21,520
passengers in fifty first class outside

1033
00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:23,619
cabins and Suites all with private

1034
00:44:28,190 --> 00:44:26,170
facilities and large windows as well as

1035
00:44:30,870 --> 00:44:28,200
a desk television and other comforts

1036
00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:30,880
public areas include a large dining room

1037
00:44:33,470 --> 00:44:32,890
accommodating all passengers in one

1038
00:44:36,300 --> 00:44:33,480
sitting

1039
00:44:39,089 --> 00:44:36,310
library lounge theater style auditorium

1040
00:44:41,910 --> 00:44:39,099
volleyball court and gymnasium heated

1041
00:44:44,220 --> 00:44:41,920
indoor swimming pool and sauna views are

1042
00:44:46,050 --> 00:44:44,230
excellent from the navigation bridge we

1043
00:44:48,180 --> 00:44:46,060
are where we are almost always welcome

1044
00:44:50,970 --> 00:44:48,190
and there are large open decks on

1045
00:44:53,960 --> 00:44:50,980
several levels the r-mo also has a good

1046
00:44:56,310 --> 00:44:53,970
polar library and a small infirmary

1047
00:44:58,470 --> 00:44:56,320
European master chefs present an

1048
00:45:00,540 --> 00:44:58,480
excellent and varied international menu

1049
00:45:03,120 --> 00:45:00,550
with fine provisions from around the

1050
00:45:05,070 --> 00:45:03,130
world a combination of European and

1051
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:05,080
experienced Russian staff will serve you

1052
00:45:09,750 --> 00:45:07,930
aboard the popular bar is stocked with

1053
00:45:12,750 --> 00:45:09,760
your favorite spirits wines and

1054
00:45:15,780 --> 00:45:12,760
champagnes sounds like a good trip rims

1055
00:45:17,550 --> 00:45:15,790
were priced from us eighteen thousand

1056
00:45:19,740 --> 00:45:17,560
nine hundred and fifty to twenty

1057
00:45:23,730 --> 00:45:19,750
thousand nine hundred fifty per person

1058
00:45:25,170 --> 00:45:23,740
depending on the room type the itinerary

1059
00:45:26,730 --> 00:45:25,180
was to start with some sightseeing

1060
00:45:29,640 --> 00:45:26,740
around Moscow and then a flight to

1061
00:45:31,859 --> 00:45:29,650
Murmansk to join the Yamal after several

1062
00:45:33,690 --> 00:45:31,869
days of sailing to the North Pole where

1063
00:45:36,050 --> 00:45:33,700
they would spend the day and even call

1064
00:45:38,670 --> 00:45:36,060
home to talk to her family at friends on

1065
00:45:41,460 --> 00:45:38,680
days nine to eleven they would start the

1066
00:45:43,170 --> 00:45:41,470
search for the North Polar opening once

1067
00:45:45,180 --> 00:45:43,180
found and this is where it starts to get

1068
00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:45,190
interesting they would travel up the

1069
00:45:50,339 --> 00:45:47,530
high deckle River to the city of Jihu

1070
00:45:52,740 --> 00:45:50,349
take a monorail trip to the city of Eden

1071
00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:52,750
and visit the palace of the king of the

1072
00:45:57,540 --> 00:45:55,690
inner world if they were unable to find

1073
00:45:59,310 --> 00:45:57,550
the polar opening their fallback

1074
00:46:01,770 --> 00:45:59,320
position would be to return via the new

1075
00:46:04,410 --> 00:46:01,780
Siberian islands to visit skeleton

1076
00:46:05,579 --> 00:46:04,420
remains of exotic animals thought to

1077
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:05,589
originate from Inner Earth

1078
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:08,050
this time Cluff success in being

1079
00:46:13,050 --> 00:46:11,410
thwarted did not fail him the expedition

1080
00:46:15,089 --> 00:46:13,060
was cancelled following the death of his

1081
00:46:17,070 --> 00:46:15,099
partner with adventurer Explorer Steve

1082
00:46:20,310 --> 00:46:17,080
curry just weeks before the planned

1083
00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:20,320
departure now further trips were planned

1084
00:46:23,760 --> 00:46:22,090
by Clough until one of

1085
00:46:25,410 --> 00:46:23,770
various expedition members who had

1086
00:46:27,750 --> 00:46:25,420
expressed interest to continue the quest

1087
00:46:29,850 --> 00:46:27,760
should reach in earth came forward with

1088
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:29,860
an offer to be their new expedition

1089
00:46:35,070 --> 00:46:33,370
leader dr. Brooks Agnew formed a new

1090
00:46:37,050 --> 00:46:35,080
expedition company put up a new

1091
00:46:39,270 --> 00:46:37,060
expedition website and began to gather

1092
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:39,280
donations for the new North Pole Inner

1093
00:46:44,130 --> 00:46:41,410
Earth expedition initially planned for

1094
00:46:45,860 --> 00:46:44,140
August 2012 then postponed to July

1095
00:46:47,910 --> 00:46:45,870
August 2013

1096
00:46:51,090 --> 00:46:47,920
unfortunately Agnew resigned in

1097
00:46:54,090 --> 00:46:51,100
September 2013 citing losses in his

1098
00:46:56,550 --> 00:46:54,100
electric car company despite these

1099
00:46:58,680 --> 00:46:56,560
continued setbacks and like followers of

1100
00:47:00,270 --> 00:46:58,690
many such theories Clough cynthaiz II

1101
00:47:02,550 --> 00:47:00,280
Azzam and single-mindedness for the

1102
00:47:04,830 --> 00:47:02,560
Hollow Earth lingers he is adamant that

1103
00:47:06,450 --> 00:47:04,840
he is right and can't understand what

1104
00:47:09,060 --> 00:47:06,460
gets into those who can't see the light

1105
00:47:11,550 --> 00:47:09,070
I don't know how the flat-earthers can

1106
00:47:14,010 --> 00:47:11,560
be so confused heaped alts some online

1107
00:47:16,620 --> 00:47:14,020
they are obviously wrong the world is

1108
00:47:19,230 --> 00:47:16,630
not flat it's Hollow they reject all the

1109
00:47:21,620 --> 00:47:19,240
evidence and with those words hangs the

1110
00:47:24,350 --> 00:47:21,630
story of the hollers dodgy evidence

1111
00:47:26,910 --> 00:47:24,360
hyperbolic and hyperactive imagination

1112
00:47:29,750 --> 00:47:26,920
conspiratorial and paranoid delusion and

1113
00:47:32,610 --> 00:47:29,760
a passion which cannot be crushed

1114
00:47:35,460 --> 00:47:32,620
crackpots or not they're a fascinating

1115
00:47:36,270 --> 00:47:35,470
Bunch and will no doubt entertainers for

1116
00:47:44,070 --> 00:47:36,280
decades to come

1117
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:44,080
with or without a home that's hole in

1118
00:47:50,130 --> 00:47:48,490
the pole from the skeptic March 2018 vol

1119
00:48:01,059 --> 00:47:50,140
38 number 1

1120
00:48:07,069 --> 00:48:03,920
the skeptic magazine the journal from

1121
00:48:09,259 --> 00:48:07,079
Australian skeptics subscribe online to

1122
00:48:14,569 --> 00:48:09,269
the world's second oldest skeptical

1123
00:48:17,779 --> 00:48:14,579
magazine visit WWF x comma u and click

1124
00:48:22,160 --> 00:48:17,789
the publication's link you can also find

1125
00:48:25,339 --> 00:48:22,170
there over 30 years on back issues free

1126
00:48:31,330 --> 00:48:25,349
to download the skeptic magazine from

1127
00:48:31,340 --> 00:48:41,780
[Music]

1128
00:48:45,660 --> 00:48:44,100
thank you for listening to the skeptic

1129
00:48:48,780 --> 00:48:45,670
zone now here's some good news regarding

1130
00:48:51,390 --> 00:48:48,790
our friend dr. Carl Crusoe miski the

1131
00:48:53,940 --> 00:48:51,400
science communicator of Australia and

1132
00:48:57,330 --> 00:48:53,950
this comes to us from the ABC the

1133
00:49:00,660 --> 00:48:57,340
national broadcaster which Carl appears

1134
00:49:03,000 --> 00:49:00,670
on every week on radio dr. Carl cruising

1135
00:49:06,630 --> 00:49:03,010
iski says he's not particularly smart

1136
00:49:09,900 --> 00:49:06,640
despite winning unesco prize a story by

1137
00:49:11,910 --> 00:49:09,910
Claudine Ryan and Suzanna Lyons it says

1138
00:49:14,190 --> 00:49:11,920
in part he might be one of Australia's

1139
00:49:16,770 --> 00:49:14,200
most well known and loved

1140
00:49:18,540 --> 00:49:16,780
scientists and now the winner of a

1141
00:49:21,630 --> 00:49:18,550
United Nations award for science

1142
00:49:24,300 --> 00:49:21,640
communication but dr. Carl Cruzan iski

1143
00:49:27,780 --> 00:49:24,310
doesn't consider himself to be that

1144
00:49:29,730 --> 00:49:27,790
brainy quote one thing that gives me a

1145
00:49:32,700 --> 00:49:29,740
great advantage is that I'm not

1146
00:49:35,280 --> 00:49:32,710
particularly smart my IQ is only about a

1147
00:49:38,760 --> 00:49:35,290
hundred and ten which is in there with

1148
00:49:43,170 --> 00:49:38,770
two thirds of the population between 115

1149
00:49:46,020 --> 00:49:43,180
and 85 in quote dr. Kyle says quote that

1150
00:49:48,840 --> 00:49:46,030
means for me to be able to understand

1151
00:49:51,060 --> 00:49:48,850
something I've really got to go into it

1152
00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:51,070
but then I understand it end quote

1153
00:49:56,100 --> 00:49:54,370
all that time delving into science has

1154
00:49:57,870 --> 00:49:56,110
not only helped generations of

1155
00:50:01,890 --> 00:49:57,880
Australians better understand the world

1156
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:01,900
around and inside them it's seen dr.

1157
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:05,170
Cole awarded the 2019 UNESCO Kalinga

1158
00:50:11,130 --> 00:50:07,330
prize for the popularization of science

1159
00:50:13,530 --> 00:50:11,140
in Budapest this week dr. Karl is the

1160
00:50:16,610 --> 00:50:13,540
first Australian to win the prize which

1161
00:50:19,110 --> 00:50:16,620
he received in recognition of his quote

1162
00:50:21,510 --> 00:50:19,120
long-standing commitment to fire up

1163
00:50:23,310 --> 00:50:21,520
people's curiosity for science and to

1164
00:50:23,790 --> 00:50:23,320
share his passion for the subject end

1165
00:50:26,210 --> 00:50:23,800
quote

1166
00:50:28,980 --> 00:50:26,220
previous winners include arthur c clarke

1167
00:50:31,620 --> 00:50:28,990
David Suzuki and Sir David Attenborough

1168
00:50:34,290 --> 00:50:31,630
and this story goes on it's quite

1169
00:50:36,030 --> 00:50:34,300
lengthy covering dr. Karl's career I'll

1170
00:50:38,130 --> 00:50:36,040
link to that in the show notes but a big

1171
00:50:40,710 --> 00:50:38,140
shout out and a big congratulations to

1172
00:50:43,530 --> 00:50:40,720
somebody I am thrilled to say as my

1173
00:50:45,500 --> 00:50:43,540
friend dr. Karl cruising is key well

1174
00:50:48,090 --> 00:50:45,510
deserved

1175
00:50:49,650 --> 00:50:48,100
today this is dr. Karl Karl Christmas be

1176
00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:49,660
proud to be skeptic and you can find out

1177
00:50:56,130 --> 00:50:51,970
more about me at dr. Karl calm and get

1178
00:51:01,920 --> 00:50:59,109
Thank You dr. Carl and I look forward to

1179
00:51:04,240 --> 00:51:01,930
catching up with you soon I hope

1180
00:51:06,220 --> 00:51:04,250
thank you to those people who continue

1181
00:51:08,830 --> 00:51:06,230
to support the skeptic zone financially

1182
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:08,840
at patreon or PayPal at skeptic zone TV

1183
00:51:14,830 --> 00:51:11,450
I say it I think I say it every week but

1184
00:51:17,170 --> 00:51:14,840
it needs to be said for two reasons one

1185
00:51:19,180 --> 00:51:17,180
I do really sincerely thank those people

1186
00:51:21,490 --> 00:51:19,190
who contribute because without you I

1187
00:51:23,800 --> 00:51:21,500
would be not doing the skeptics own and

1188
00:51:26,680 --> 00:51:23,810
- it's to encourage other people who

1189
00:51:30,010 --> 00:51:26,690
maybe have not yet contributed to the

1190
00:51:33,100 --> 00:51:30,020
skeptic zone to consider doing so they

1191
00:51:35,260 --> 00:51:33,110
can only be something like $5 a month a

1192
00:51:36,820 --> 00:51:35,270
big shout out and congratulations to my

1193
00:51:40,859 --> 00:51:36,830
friend and colleague Brian Dunning at

1194
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:40,869
the skeptoid podcast who just celebrated

1195
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:43,490
700 episodes I've got a bit of catching

1196
00:51:49,600 --> 00:51:45,770
up to do and finally don't forget to

1197
00:51:53,170 --> 00:51:49,610
check out Maynard calm day you form a

1198
00:51:57,340 --> 00:51:53,180
nerds range of podcasts and also also

1199
00:51:59,740 --> 00:51:57,350
folks if you need a DJ over the holiday

1200
00:52:03,310 --> 00:51:59,750
period here in Australia and you're in

1201
00:52:06,340 --> 00:52:03,320
the Sydney area head for Maynard comm

1202
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:06,350
got a you and book Maynard for your next

1203
00:52:12,310 --> 00:52:10,010
gig party or corporate event and finally

1204
00:52:14,520 --> 00:52:12,320
finally I'm certainly looking forward to

1205
00:52:16,900 --> 00:52:14,530
seeing you skeptic zone fans at the

1206
00:52:20,830 --> 00:52:16,910
skeptic on in Melbourne coming up in

1207
00:52:22,599 --> 00:52:20,840
only a very short few weeks away not

1208
00:52:23,859 --> 00:52:22,609
only will may not and I be there from

1209
00:52:26,440 --> 00:52:23,869
the skeptic zone but many other

1210
00:52:29,380 --> 00:52:26,450
reporters - including around sir give

1211
00:52:32,260 --> 00:52:29,390
mandala noble Heidi Robertson the raw

1212
00:52:35,950 --> 00:52:32,270
skeptic Trish Han from Trish and chips

1213
00:52:38,020 --> 00:52:35,960
and dr. Paul II but for this week this

1214
00:52:44,349 --> 00:52:38,030
is Richard Saunders signing off from

1215
00:52:47,380 --> 00:52:44,359
Sydney Australia you've been listening

1216
00:52:51,700 --> 00:52:47,390
to the skeptic zone podcast please visit

1217
00:52:54,970 --> 00:52:51,710
our website at WWF Texan TV for sure

1218
00:52:58,470 --> 00:52:54,980
nerds contacts and to access the back

1219
00:53:01,120 --> 00:52:58,480
catalog of episodes going back to 2008

1220
00:53:04,420 --> 00:53:01,130
you can follow the skeptic zone podcast

1221
00:53:07,580 --> 00:53:04,430
on twitter at skeptic zone visit our

1222
00:53:10,260 --> 00:53:07,590
facebook page or leave a review on h

1223
00:53:13,650 --> 00:53:10,270
you can also support the sceptic zone

1224
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:13,660
via patreon or PayPal the skeptic Zone

1225
00:53:18,750 --> 00:53:17,050
podcast is an independent production the

1226
00:53:20,850 --> 00:53:18,760
views and opinions expressed on the

1227
00:53:23,220 --> 00:53:20,860
skeptic zone are not necessarily those

1228
00:53:28,140 --> 00:53:23,230
of Australian skeptics or any other

1229
00:53:28,150 --> 00:53:35,980
you

1230
00:53:40,280 --> 00:53:38,420
hello to the afterthoughts the people

1231
00:53:41,750 --> 00:53:40,290
who listen after the music we're going

1232
00:53:44,420 --> 00:53:41,760
to play the dice game again this week

1233
00:53:46,490 --> 00:53:44,430
for those of you new to this section of

1234
00:53:50,330 --> 00:53:46,500
the show I every now and then I roll a

1235
00:53:51,950 --> 00:53:50,340
dice to die there's one and see if you

1236
00:53:53,930 --> 00:53:51,960
can use your psychic or any other

1237
00:53:57,470 --> 00:53:53,940
predicting powers you have we always say

1238
00:54:01,370 --> 00:53:57,480
psychic but we don't mean psychic to see

1239
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:01,380
if you can yes yes guess what number

1240
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:03,330
comes up I'm going to roll this three

1241
00:54:11,360 --> 00:54:04,890
times and this week

1242
00:54:15,620 --> 00:54:11,370
for something different it's a d4 d4 so

1243
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:15,630
if you get all where's my pin there is

1244
00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:20,850
do you get all four numbers correct that

1245
00:54:30,650 --> 00:54:25,410
gives you a the odds are 4 times 4 times

1246
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:30,660
4 or 4 times 4 is 16 16 times 4 is of

1247
00:54:38,840 --> 00:54:35,490
course 64 so you have a 1 in 64 chance

1248
00:54:43,010 --> 00:54:38,850
of getting all numbers hmm here we go

1249
00:54:46,540 --> 00:54:43,020
first one shaking the die now and the

1250
00:54:52,490 --> 00:54:46,550
first number that comes up is 4

1251
00:54:58,880 --> 00:54:52,500
okay it's taken 1 coming up now next

1252
00:55:06,970 --> 00:54:58,890
number is 2 for 2 last number guess away

1253
00:55:10,820 --> 00:55:06,980
and 3 there we go if you shouted out

1254
00:55:13,270 --> 00:55:10,830
wrote down thought before the dice was

1255
00:55:16,250 --> 00:55:13,280
rolled are the numbers for 2 & 3

1256
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:16,260
you've got odds there you've beaten odds

1257
00:55:24,500 --> 00:55:21,410
or you've matched odds of 64 to 1 and

1258
00:55:26,540 --> 00:55:24,510
you what do you win you win a chance to